[BLCKWLF]

Man shot in struggle with Phoenix officer

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...16phoenix-officer-struggle-man-shot-abrk.html

The article said that the police officers gun jammed, I happen to know for a fact that Phoenix PD issues Glock firearms. They get a choice between .40 and .45 and the three sizes of each. Most carry the G22. My only question is "Why did it jam?".

Speculations, thoughts, opinions?

 

[Matthew780]

Man shot in struggle with Phoenix officer

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...16phoenix-officer-struggle-man-shot-abrk.html

The article said that the police officers gun jammed, I happen to know for a fact that Phoenix PD issues Glock firearms. They get a choice between .40 and .45 and the three sizes of each. Most carry the G22. My only question is "Why did it jam?".

Speculations, thoughts, opinions?

The way I read & understand it, the gun jammed while being fired during hand-to-hand combat. ANY semi-auto pistol can malfunction due to a number of anomalies in a situation like that where such things as grip on the gun is nowhere near adequate for proper operation, unlike a revolver which would tend to be more stable and forgiving in the areas of limp-wristing, a struggle for control of the gun which could physically obstruct the slide from operating normally, etc..

 

[SHOOTER13]

Was there a struggle for weapon retention...?

 

[BLCKWLF]

Was there a struggle for weapon retention...?

It seems so...

 

[BLCKWLF]

But what would keep that first round from going off? Limp wristing and slide grabs keep the gun from cycling the next round. Why didn't the first round, assuming it was chambered, go off?

 

[BLCKWLF]

Just forewarning to anyone reading this... I am really into this puzzle thing, I want to figure it out. I like this type of stuff. By no means do I mean to lash out at anyone, I am asking questions, which according to Sherlock, can make me seem like an *******. My apologies ahead of time.

 

[brutusvk]

Btw, I believe phx pd can carry other pistols as well. Many agencies in the Valley have "approve weapons lists". Not to mention I know how many people "care" for thier weapons. I personally have been at the range for qual and an officer's weapon was broken and they did not even know it. Many ONLY shoot for thier annual qual. So this does not suprise me.

 

[BLCKWLF]

Btw, I believe phx pd can carry other pistols as well. Many agencies in the Valley have "approve weapons lists". Not to mention I know how many people "care" for thier weapons. I personally have been at the range for qual and an officer's weapon was broken and they did not even know it. Many ONLY shoot for thier annual qual. So this does not suprise me.

I am suspecting that the officer may have made errors in the care of his weapon. Odds are, it is a Glock as that is what the department issues, though it is possible that he was carrying a different "approved weapon".

Still, why couldn't he get the first round off? Was he carrying in C3?

 

[Matthew780]

Still, why couldn't he get the first round off? Was he carrying in C3?

I see no evidence that the 1st round failed. The article said the gun jammed during the second "struggle". To me, that implies that a round did go off and a jam followed. Then the officer recovered, cleared the jam, and shot the man in the leg.

???

Or maybe the 1st round did fail/jam... ? Could have been a squib. Could have just been a complete mis-fire. Don't know. There's really not enough fact in the article to know for sure.

 

[brutusvk]

AZ POST standards means you carry condition 1. There are too many things that could happen to cause a gun to malfuction. I am not going to assume anything. The gun could have been knocked out of battery. The gun could have had a mechanical defect. The ammo could have had a bad primer. I have no idea about Phx PD policies regarding the duty weapons. If it was a Glock, and let's assume it was, they can fail. ANY gun make can fail. It could be lack of care for the user (not saying it was in this case) or it could be all the things mentioned above and more. Thank God the Officer wasn't killed.

 

[BLCKWLF]

Too many plausibilities....

 

[Matthew780]

Thank God the Officer wasn't killed.

Amen & amen.

 

[glocknloaded]

The guy at my local gun store was telling me about a LEO trade in. That was one of the worst Glocks he ever seen, he said it was a back up and not used much but was filled with lent and dirt like it hadn't been cleaned in years.

A few years ago on tv I saw a video where a Lady Cop was in a struggle for her gun he won point the gun at here and pulled the trigger and nothing happened they were both in shock but she responded much quicker tackled him he dropped the gun she grabbed it and while they were on the ground struggling she pulled the trigger and the gun went Bang and news shot and threat was over. In an interview she said the gun wasn't on safe and she should have been dead. I personally am a religious man and I chalked it up to a help from above I am sure it could been many things but sometimes stuff just happens the way it should, in the Arizona case they struggled and the good guy won just happy it ended that way but if I was that LEO I would go home clean my pistol and pray before dinner

 

[BLCKWLF]

The guy at my local gun store was telling me about a LEO trade in. That was one of the worst Glocks he ever seen, he said it was a back up and not used much but was filled with lent and dirt like it hadn't been cleaned in years.

A few years ago on tv I saw a video where a Lady Cop was in a struggle for her gun he won point the gun at here and pulled the trigger and nothing happened they were both in shock but she responded much quicker tackled him he dropped the gun she grabbed it and while they were on the ground struggling she pulled the trigger and the gun went Bang and news shot and threat was over. In an interview she said the gun wasn't on safe and she should have been dead. I personally am a religious man and I chalked it up to a help from above I am sure it could been many things but sometimes stuff just happens the way it should, in the Arizona case they struggled and the good guy won just happy it ended that way but if I was that LEO I would go home clean my pistol and pray before dinner

I have a police trade in from El Paso Sheriffs office... It has wear and tear on the outside but the internals are as good as new. Of course, every gun is different. I would only hope that all LEOs would keep their gear in working order. And praying before dinner certainly wouldn't hurt either!

 

[glocknloaded]

I have a police trade in from El Paso Sheriffs office... It has wear and tear on the outside but the internals are as good as new. Of course, every gun is different. I would only hope that all LEOs would keep their gear in working order. And praying before dinner certainly wouldn't hurt either!

I am sure most LEOs do and I always assumed they did but that's what are conversation was about and how he couldn't believe how dirty the inside of this particular gun was.

 

[acarson529c]

Tap rack and flip baby.

 

[SHOOTER13]

Any number of things could have happen, as we will never know what condition it was carried in ( C1,2,3 ),

what condition the officer kept the firearm ( clean / dirty ), what and where it was grabbed during the struggle...

and a hundred other things...including that anything man made is not perfect...including said officer.

Also, and I know this for a fact...many LEO's are really not "gun people"...they strap it on, along with their cuffs, extra mags,

knife, flashlight, vest, etc...the same thing every shift, every day. Then maybe qualify with it twice a year, at most. Just another

piece of equipment...weight around their waist. Until the SHTF...

 

[iGlock]

IMO the gun jammed after the first round when off becuase the officer and BG may have been fighting for it. Then the officer gets control of the gun, clears the jam and fires in the leg.