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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know this is a big debate and Ive been iffy about posting this but I want to know "preferably from people who own both" whats your take is on 9mm vs .40.Ive never owned a 9mm and pretty much been raised on .40,but recently Ive been thinking about switching to 9mm mainly because of higher capacity.Please let me know about your experiance with both what you prefer and why,and please lets try to be civil mature adults.
 

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King of my Castle until my wife comes home
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I love my 3 9mm and carry them often I also love my 2 .40 S&W and have been carrying them often I put them in a rotation. I do however practice more with the 9 mm. Cheaper ammo... I may start reloading...
 

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I can't remember the forum but I read a blog from a pathologist who also happens to be a shooter. He had first hand knowledge of damage left behind as all his customers had already gone on to other places. His preference was heavy bullets that would penetrate and not be deflected by bone before going through major organs. I really just boiled down a lot of his info and took out his reservations and exceptions ( but he carried a .45). Remember shot placement is king, and of equal importance is logistics. How many calibers do you want to stock? One (just one because there are many more) of the benefits of the glock system is commonality of mags. So if I get a 26 after I already have a 17, all my mags for the 17 will fit in the 26. Saving me from immediately having to buy more mags, and ammo on hand will work.
 

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of those 2 I've evolved to the 9mm. with good bullets I think the gap has closed between the 2. 45 a.c.p. is my fave for a full sized pistol.
 

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I love 9mm. It holds more rounds in the mag then the .40. It isn't as snappy as .40. Premium ammo is comparable to the .40 in penetration in the FBI tests.


That being said I own 2 .40s's and won't get rid of them for 9mm (mainly because the one is modded so selling it would be pointless as I'd never get the money back out of it, and the other shares ammo so getting rid of that means I have to buy two different boxes of ammo to go shooting).

If I could find a good deal on selling my 22C and my 27 and getting a 19C and a 26 I would trade but I don't think I would so I don't worry about it.
 

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"The Sarge"
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All of the service calibers work or fail about the same. Calibers are options. Above all, use what you have confidence in. Think of calibers as options. And today's modern, high tech bullet designs have leveled the playing field. For 13 years I carried 9mm on duty and never felt under gunned. Like everyone else I moved on to the larger calibers. Now I have gone full circle and carry 9mm again. I also like the 357SIG and find it shoots much better for me than 40. Though early on the American gun press bad mouthed the 9mm as it became popular and wrongly formed opinions that are passed on to this very day. Not so in the rest of the world where there is very little interest in other calibers. The 9mm is the world's militry caliber because it works and is very efficient. More people have been stopped and killed by 9mm than all the other handgun calibers multiplied. Reality is if an attacker does not stop when shot in the proper place by a quality 9mm JHP, he would not stop when hit with a larger caliber under the same conditions. Failure to stop training is paramount. I like the 9mm for capacity and quick follow up shots especially when you have to seek alternate targets. Bill
 

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Used to carry 40 now 9. The "bigger is better" argument is null and void IMO with today's ammunition and the fact of the ones who constantly scream this won't volunteer to get shot with the smaller to prove their point.;) BUT I do carry "heavy per caliber" in 9mm using the 147.

I personally prefer more rounds.
 

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I have been carrying my 9 over my 40 because I just shoot the 9 better. If I could shoot the 40 as good as the 9 then I would be carrying it more.
 

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I've shot both and I like both. Right now I only own a 9mm, but ultimately I'd like to have both. However, if I had to have only one I'd probably stick with the 9mm.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thank you all for your advice and input,my concern is with carry and stocking up,mainly stocking up because 9mm is cheaper and easier to find and since it is a NATO round you can buy military grade ammo and in my opinion better quality ammo than what you will normaly find in stores as far as FMJ goes.As for carry im with Thesarge if a 9mm doesnt stop em more than likley bigger calibers wont either.Ive actually always been one of the "big caliber lovin 9mm hating guys" but looking at taking defensive classes and seeing EXPERTS with tons of training and combat experiance carrying the 9mm it has swayed me.
 

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I have a G23 but after having it for awhile I got tired of 40. And didn't feel comfortable with it.so I did s complete transition to a 9mm with KKM conversation barrel and 9mm ejector and extractor. So now I have 2 guns in one
 

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I can't remember the forum but I read a blog from a pathologist who also happens to be a shooter. He had first hand knowledge of damage left behind as all his customers had already gone on to other places. His preference was heavy bullets that would penetrate and not be deflected by bone before going through major organs. I really just boiled down a lot of his info and took out his reservations and exceptions ( but he carried a .45). Remember shot placement is king, and of equal importance is logistics. How many calibers do you want to stock? One (just one because there are many more) of the benefits of the glock system is commonality of mags. So if I get a 26 after I already have a 17, all my mags for the 17 will fit in the 26. Saving me from immediately having to buy more mags, and ammo on hand will work.
You probably saw it on AR15.com. I believe that's where he originally posted it.

As far as shot placement, which everyone goes on & on about in these caliber debates, because they're positive that even under stress they'll put all their rounds center mass, I'll say this; go watch the video of the NYC Empire State Building suspect shooting.

Say what you want about law enforcement not shooting as much as you do or NYPD's heavy triggers, and there will be any number of LEOs here who will argue back, and there will be any number of people who carried DA revolvers or DAO guns for a long time that will argue about the heavy, but consistent, triggers.

The results come down to when you're in fear for your life, the adrenaline is pumping and how much, and how well, you train is going to determine how well you shoot.

Very few CCW folks really train enough in shooting or drawing. Most don't ever get formal training and even fewer get stressed force on force training, which is still nothing compared to the real thing.

When you have tunnel vision, your fine motor skills are gone and you're fighting for your life, your shot placement is only going to be about 1/2 as good as your best training. Under stress, you're group size doubles, at least. That's assuming, of course, that you even get rounds on target.

Unless you're training daily in dry fire and presentation and at least weekly in live fire and presentation, you're going to be lucky to put rounds where you think they'll go.

This NYPD shooting is a good example of that. I haven't seen how many rounds were fired yet, or how many times the subject was hit, but we know they missed him entirely, from 10 feet or less, at least 9 times.

One of the officers was shooting one handed, while calling for backup with the other. How many people include significant one handed, or off hand training?

I know I'm guilty of not training enough. I live fire as much as I can afford to, but I'm in a position where it will often come down to not having an extra dollar in the month, much less $10. I have ammo, but it's in finite quantity and will be difficult to replenish.

Training videos don't take the place of a class, but they're a step above nothing, and those I have. I learned things I'm doing wrong, or not doing well enough at least, in 45 minutes of watching the first one. It's a start.

Thank you all for your advice and input,my concern is with carry and stocking up,mainly stocking up because 9mm is cheaper and easier to find and since it is a NATO round you can buy military grade ammo and in my opinion better quality ammo than what you will normaly find in stores as far as FMJ goes.As for carry im with Thesarge if a 9mm doesnt stop em more than likley bigger calibers wont either.Ive actually always been one of the "big caliber lovin 9mm hating guys" but looking at taking defensive classes and seeing EXPERTS with tons of training and combat experiance carrying the 9mm it has swayed me.
After spending several hours watching videos and reading the ballistic gelatin test results of various HPs in various calibers, I am warming up to 9mm. If I were ever to carry it, and this is also based on those test results, I would only carry 147gr, maybe 124gr, and I would most likely carry Speer Gold Dots.

Across all calibers, and compared to every major high quality brand of HPs, the Gold Dots were the most consistent in expansion in bare gelatin and through 4 layers of denim. Many other "high quality" HPs clogged with clothing, including Hydra-Shoks, which I carried for a decade and Hornady XTPs, which replaced the Hydra-Shoks. Right now, it's Critical Defense in .40 and Gold Dots in .45GAP.

Eventually, every HP I own, in all calibers, will be replaced with Gold Dots. They out performed all Hornady offerings, Winchester Ranger-T & PDX, Federal HST & Hydra-Shoks and the other old tech like Remington Golden Sabers. Some were closer than others, but none surpassed the reliability of the GDs.

I've carried .40 for almost 15 years and I'm more than satisfied with its capability and ammo capacity, as well as my shooting of it. I've never owned 9mm, but I have fired a G19 side by side with my G23 and I didn't really feel it was significantly less recoil or any more accurate.

I have found that I shoot .45GAP, which has become my favorite round now, a lot better than I shoot anything else. For me, that includes .45ACP. I let a friend shoot my G37 and he was surprised at how much easier it was to shoot over his .40. The first magazine he shot as well, and maybe a little better, than he did with .40. I also shoot it better than what I've shot with 9mm, even though I've shot about the same quantity of GAP & 9mm.
 

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45ACP is my first choice for a semi-auto handgun cartridge. Not because I think it's so superior but because it works well with cast bullets.
Second choice would be the 9x19mm because it's been around a long time and you can get ammo inexpensively and most 9's hold a lot of rounds which is always a plus.
3rd if I was pushed into it would probably be 10mm Auto, no real reason other then it having decent ballistics.
As far as the 40 S&W goes I, personally, have NO USE for it. If you like it great, shoot it but I'd rather have a full power 10mm Auto in that caliber then the "Short n' Weak".LOL.
 

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Glockn Rollin
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I prefer .40. I know most of the debates and information presented is false. My personal reason is that the capacity is close to 9mm. It is a little larger than 9mm so in the case of a failure to expand, the diameter is larger, but also when it does expand, the diameter is larger as well. Would I be comfortable carrying a 9mm? Sure. But since I have the option, I will go with .40. I can control the recoil just as well as with a 9mm.
 

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Junior Member
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
You probably saw it on AR15.com. I believe that's where he originally posted it.

As far as shot placement, which everyone goes on & on about in these caliber debates, because they're positive that even under stress they'll put all their rounds center mass, I'll say this; go watch the video of the NYC Empire State Building suspect shooting.

Say what you want about law enforcement not shooting as much as you do or NYPD's heavy triggers, and there will be any number of LEOs here who will argue back, and there will be any number of people who carried DA revolvers or DAO guns for a long time that will argue about the heavy, but consistent, triggers.

The results come down to when you're in fear for your life, the adrenaline is pumping and how much, and how well, you train is going to determine how well you shoot.

Very few CCW folks really train enough in shooting or drawing. Most don't ever get formal training and even fewer get stressed force on force training, which is still nothing compared to the real thing.

When you have tunnel vision, your fine motor skills are gone and you're fighting for your life, your shot placement is only going to be about 1/2 as good as your best training. Under stress, you're group size doubles, at least. That's assuming, of course, that you even get rounds on target.

Unless you're training daily in dry fire and presentation and at least weekly in live fire and presentation, you're going to be lucky to put rounds where you think they'll go.

This NYPD shooting is a good example of that. I haven't seen how many rounds were fired yet, or how many times the subject was hit, but we know they missed him entirely, from 10 feet or less, at least 9 times.

One of the officers was shooting one handed, while calling for backup with the other. How many people include significant one handed, or off hand training?

I know I'm guilty of not training enough. I live fire as much as I can afford to, but I'm in a position where it will often come down to not having an extra dollar in the month, much less $10. I have ammo, but it's in finite quantity and will be difficult to replenish.

Training videos don't take the place of a class, but they're a step above nothing, and those I have. I learned things I'm doing wrong, or not doing well enough at least, in 45 minutes of watching the first one. It's a start.



After spending several hours watching videos and reading the ballistic gelatin test results of various HPs in various calibers, I am warming up to 9mm. If I were ever to carry it, and this is also based on those test results, I would only carry 147gr, maybe 124gr, and I would most likely carry Speer Gold Dots.

Across all calibers, and compared to every major high quality brand of HPs, the Gold Dots were the most consistent in expansion in bare gelatin and through 4 layers of denim. Many other "high quality" HPs clogged with clothing, including Hydra-Shoks, which I carried for a decade and Hornady XTPs, which replaced the Hydra-Shoks. Right now, it's Critical Defense in .40 and Gold Dots in .45GAP.

Eventually, every HP I own, in all calibers, will be replaced with Gold Dots. They out performed all Hornady offerings, Winchester Ranger-T & PDX, Federal HST & Hydra-Shoks and the other old tech like Remington Golden Sabers. Some were closer than others, but none surpassed the reliability of the GDs.

I've carried .40 for almost 15 years and I'm more than satisfied with its capability and ammo capacity, as well as my shooting of it. I've never owned 9mm, but I have fired a G19 side by side with my G23 and I didn't really feel it was significantly less recoil or any more accurate.

I have found that I shoot .45GAP, which has become my favorite round now, a lot better than I shoot anything else. For me, that includes .45ACP. I let a friend shoot my G37 and he was surprised at how much easier it was to shoot over his .40. The first magazine he shot as well, and maybe a little better, than he did with .40. I also shoot it better than what I've shot with 9mm, even though I've shot about the same quantity of GAP & 9mm.

Thank you for the input,I agree that in an actual situation that accuracy will go down dramaticly and that is why Im seriously looking at goin to the 9mm because in the end more ammo is better than less ammo.My opinion on deffensive ammo is the same and I currently carry 165 grn speer golddots in my 23.
 

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PROPER Training is king. As stated, when the adrenaline starts to pump, things that are not second nature go right out the window.

And, As most everyone has been saying, modern 9mm ammo produces similar results to the .40 and having extra rounds is a plus.

I have a g23, have the conversion to a 9mm (for economical practice), have a g17. I can shoot. Oth calipers and I carry .40. The g17 is too large and I won't trust my life for a conversion kit. So, I'm carrying .40. Not because it's a better round, just because for my situation, that's what works best for me.

YMMV
D
 

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Used to carry 40 now 9. The "bigger is better" argument is null and void IMO with today's ammunition and the fact of the ones who constantly scream this won't volunteer to get shot with the smaller to prove their point.;) BUT I do carry "heavy per caliber" in 9mm using the 147.

I personally prefer more rounds.
I won't volunteer to get shot with a 22 either to prove that a 45 ACP is better but I think we can all agree it is probably a bit better than a 22? SHEESh What kind of Logic is that?:confused::confused::confused: Has technology decreased the gap? Sure it has but it hasn't erased it. Now if you shoot a 9mm a lot better than a 45 then it settles the difference there! Because no matter how how much better the 45 is you still have to be able to hit the target.
 

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I prefer 9mm mainly cause of price I believe that all chambers are deadly if shot placement is correct. But I also favor 357. Magnum for revolvers cause even if I miss, the sound will give them a heart attack lol but ammos to high to miss lol
 

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Click Click Boom
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You can't slug a .45 anywhere and magically the guys arm or leg is gonna fall off..

Same with 9 and 40...

So no matter what you shoot bottom line it needs to land on target and in a vital area. Now what ever caliber you can do that with good for you. Unless your walking around with your 12ga slung over your shoulder loaded with 3" slugs or a Barrett 50 you need to land in a vital area.

Your magical handgun round that is gonna stop the bad guy with a hit in the arm just isn't realistic so we're back to shot placement.

As for the NYC shooting I can understand sticking up for the officers involved and I am not saying that I could have done better BUT when that many civilians are hit and that many bullets missed there target at 10 ft it's a bad shooting with a bad outcome.

If the NYPDs pride is to high to step back and look at what happened and build onto there training then shame on them. You ever play ball in school? You study tapes.. Why to improve on your performance, to learn from your mistakes.. Same thing? No! But same concept. JMO

For the record I am very happy none of are men in blue where seriously hurt and I have a up most respect for all LEO but just like anyone with a CCW there's a responsibility to train, be responsible for your bullets and the outcome of where there heading.
 
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