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I was largely unsuccessful getting S&W PC associates to comment, let alone commit, on another run of the 610 revolver while at the NRA show. I even asked what the up-charge would be for a single gun build.
 

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Best non-hardcast bullet for black bear? Does the XTP have enough penetration?

I bought a gen 4 Glock 20 last week, and I also purchased some Underwood Xtreme penetrators and Honady 180 grain XTP to carry while hiking in Arizona. I moved here last year, from a place that doesnt really have bears (Alabama).

To that effect, would the underwood flat nose FMJ be better than the extreme pentrator?

Other possible threats are mountain lions.

I've killed deer, hogs, coyotes, etc.. but never a bear.
 

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I’m considering Underwood Xtreme Hunter 10mm for woods carry. South Florida isn’t known for bear attacks but I’m not chancing a wrong encounter with a sow caring for cubs. My understanding is these rounds don’t penetrate as much as the Penetrator but penetrate enough yet create a larger permanent wound cavity. Depending who you talk to. Basically a heavier Xtreme Defender. Might also work well on two footed morons who thought you were fair game.
 

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I’m considering Underwood Xtreme Hunter 10mm for woods carry. South Florida isn’t known for bear attacks but I’m not chancing a wrong encounter with a sow caring for cubs. My understanding is these rounds don’t penetrate as much as the Penetrator but penetrate enough yet create a larger permanent wound cavity. Depending who you talk to. Basically a heavier Xtreme Defender. Might also work well on two footed morons who thought you were fair game.

I fired some xtreme penetrators out of my G20 this past weekend, and they shot pretty accurately @ 75 feet away. In my opinion the recoil seemed to be slightly less than with underwoods gold dot ammo, or Hornady's 180 grain XTP for reference (I had 5 of each in one magazine).


Where I ordered them from did not have any of the 10 grain heavier xtreme hunter ammo in stock.

I emailed underwood this morning to get their opinion, and I will share their reply once I get one.

I have read some opinions stating that the extra appearance of damage in gel is from the penetrator type ammo is due to the stretch cavity. I'd like to see some actual footage of it being used for hunting. I guess the other charateristic it has, is that it doesnt yaw like a backheavy FMJ.

Razor Dobbs (I think?) has some 10mm hunting videos on YouTube that are pretty interesting.
 

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Responce from underwood, regarding my question about a bullet for both moutain lions and black bear in 10mm:

"One bullet for both animals would definitely be the 140gr Xtreme Penetrator! The Xtreme Penetrator is our top pick for a multitude of dangerous game and is a very effective bullet, offering more wounding potential than a 200gr hard cast, which would be the number two pick!"
 

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Responce from underwood, regarding my question about a bullet for both moutain lions and black bear in 10mm:

"One bullet for both animals would definitely be the 140gr Xtreme Penetrator! The Xtreme Penetrator is our top pick for a multitude of dangerous game and is a very effective bullet, offering more wounding potential than a 200gr hard cast, which would be the number two pick!"
Now I’m confused. Why did they put out Xtreme Hunter? Thought that’s because it would be more effective on game than Penetrator.
 

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Now I’m confused. Why did they put out Xtreme Hunter? Thought that’s because it would be more effective on game than Penetrator.
Maybe in a hunting situation, you will have access to better shot placement, like lungs or heart V.S. an attack situation where the vitals are not likely to be as accessible without significant penetration.

That is to say, the hunter round may cause more trauma in soft tissue, which would be better in a hunting situation. In the event a bear is facing you, you may need penetration to get through a skull or heavy bones to reach his vitals.

That's my guess.
 

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I think if only mountain lions were a concern, the hunter or hornady XTP bullet would both be better choices.

I was curious if they would reccomed their flat nosed FMJ ammo, as their write up on it says it's for backwoods carry.
 

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Maybe in a hunting situation, you will have access to better shot placement, like lungs or heart V.S. an attack situation where the vitals are not likely to be as accessible without significant penetration.

That is to say, the hunter round may cause more trauma in soft tissue, which would be better in a hunting situation. In the event a bear is facing you, you may need penetration to get through a skull or heavy bones to reach his vitals.

That's my guess.
That makes sense. :)
 

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I would love to see a Glock 36 sized 10 mm ( single stack) addition to the Line!!!
Good sized for concealment, fantastic firepower!!!!! Just the right balance
 

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I've found this forum and this page because of an interest in carrying a 10mm on hikes in black bear country. DoubleTap makes a 230gr Hardcast Solid bullet that does 1120fps / 641 ft. lbs. out of a Glock 20. It's pricey, and according to Hickok45 on Youtube doesn't do well out of a Glock barrel, but does very well out of a LW barrel.
 
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I've found this forum and this page because of an interest in carrying a 10mm on hikes in black bear country. DoubleTap makes a 230gr Hardcast Solid bullet that does 1120fps / 641 ft. lbs. out of a Glock 20. It's pricey, and according to Hickok45 on Youtube doesn't do well out of a Glock barrel, but does very well out of a LW barrel.
I talked to Underwood the other day. They recommend the extreme penetrator over the hardcast for bear. Extreme penetrator shoots well in my 20.
 

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I got in to 10mm recently with a gen4 g40 MOS, then added a TNW ASR 10mm carbine to the collection (uses same mags). Great caliber, and I can get cheap range 10mm for $15-$16 box so on par with .45acp cost wise. SGAmmo had Magtec for $15/box last I looked.
I also picked up a Hi Point 1095 carbine last week, haven't had a chance to get to the range yet but this isn't my first Hi Point carbine, they're crude & basic but so far everyone I've had has been reliable.
While my ASR carbine seems to group everything well, the G40 definitely has a preference for Sig Elite at the range. The Sig Elite also seems to be loaded warmer than the slightly cheaper Magtec or S&B. My LGS usually only has a few boxes on the shelf but at $20/box I grab every one I can. Their S&B 10mm runs $18 so the extra $2 is well spent.
PPU has also shot well for me for range use, not my first choice but they also have a JHP round that's the same cost as their FMJ so it's a budget friendly option if you want to train with the same round you carry.
Haven't shot much Underwood yet, but it's pretty impressive. In revolvers I'd usually go with Buffalo Bore hard cast but I think Underwood is the king of 10mm.
Just wish there were more options in 10mm handguns. A 1911 would be nice, but you have to do your homework and make sure you either get one with good chamber support or drop a barrel in that does, and make sure you're not undersprung. That's why I went G40, right out of the box it was ready to handle anything. I'd like to try an EAA Witness steel frame in 10mm one of these days.
 

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I got in to 10mm recently with a gen4 g40 MOS, then added a TNW ASR 10mm carbine to the collection (uses same mags). Great caliber, and I can get cheap range 10mm for $15-$16 box so on par with .45acp cost wise. SGAmmo had Magtec for $15/box last I looked.
I also picked up a Hi Point 1095 carbine last week, haven't had a chance to get to the range yet but this isn't my first Hi Point carbine, they're crude & basic but so far everyone I've had has been reliable.
While my ASR carbine seems to group everything well, the G40 definitely has a preference for Sig Elite at the range. The Sig Elite also seems to be loaded warmer than the slightly cheaper Magtec or S&B. My LGS usually only has a few boxes on the shelf but at $20/box I grab every one I can. Their S&B 10mm runs $18 so the extra $2 is well spent.
PPU has also shot well for me for range use, not my first choice but they also have a JHP round that's the same cost as their FMJ so it's a budget friendly option if you want to train with the same round you carry.
Haven't shot much Underwood yet, but it's pretty impressive. In revolvers I'd usually go with Buffalo Bore hard cast but I think Underwood is the king of 10mm.
Just wish there were more options in 10mm handguns. A 1911 would be nice, but you have to do your homework and make sure you either get one with good chamber support or drop a barrel in that does, and make sure you're not undersprung. That's why I went G40, right out of the box it was ready to handle anything. I'd like to try an EAA Witness steel frame in 10mm one of these days.
A 10mm is like a race car compared to a 45 ACP!!!! I use them concealed
 

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Here is a thread dedicated to 10 mm guns and ammo where people can discuss 10mm guns , ammo, post pictures and reviews about caliber. Please limit the discussion to the topic.
Will 45. 21 .Or. 30 .Mags .Work .With .10 .Mm .Ammo .If .I .Put .A 10 mm. Barrel .In .My .Pistol
 

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Are the mags for a 20 same as for a 21? I assumed they are different and I would need new mags. Would be nice to save some cash for a change.
They won’t work for both calibers. I squeezed the lips of some 26 round Asian made mags to feed 10mm. That was for a Kriss carbine.
 
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